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The Observer: A Weekend Diner Turns Racist

Written by TheObserver from the blog TheTVObserver on 24 Nov 2008
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Without wasting time I will get down to the issue…too shocked. I find awkward moments funny but this was not funny….it was DEMENTED!

I was invited to a private dinner which seemed like a great place to be, the house was breath taking, the hospitality was almost prefect – I am too demanding, the whole six course diner was worth the drive and the conversation about television in South Africa and what could be done to advance it, enabled a professional debate with intellectuals. However, this took a very nasty turn which left everyone shocked and their mouths open for more than a minute in the deafening silence. I would have laughed at this, if only the reason was not horrible.

Please note, the dinner was attended by a mix of races and everyone there was from a position of influence in their respective field in entertainment and businesses associated with entertainment in some way or the other (finance etc). It was a grand affair and we all wanted to have a great time talking about digital television, satellite television, blog’s, programs, etc if its on television the night was all about discussing ways to improve it “if there where any”; laugh at it; praise it and wish we were in it “guilty pleasures” or owned it.

After we gave praise to the chef for a wonderful meal. The discussion took a sharp curve when we suddenly found ourselves discussing how executives dress and people who ask for appointments in general. It is at this juncture that we started admiring how certain people make advances in television due to their intelligence and sheer passion that the host (someone not from entertainment) shocked us with this statement.

He said “When a black person walks in to a meeting all dressed up and talking English and sounding intelligent. All I see is a baboon, well dressed and spoken” Mind you the room had a fare share of black people and the temperature dropped to arctic levels, instantly.

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I took a second to look at everyone on the table and all I saw was unbelievable shock and utter dismay. He (the host) kept going, but I could not listen to any of that vile statement. It took a good minute after the interjection, for the guests to regain their calm. Before anyone could say anything since we were all CRAZY SHOCKED and ready to explode.

I stood up and told him (the host), that no one in their right mind would be so stupid and as racist as to say such vile things in the company of black people and I expressed complete anger and outrage that such a statement would be said even if it was in jest. I made it clear that it was not acceptable even in the privacy of non-blacks. Of course black guests were obviously upset whilst other races were completely taken aback and showed concern for black guests but for me that was not good enough.

Needless to say, I stood up and left. I could not spend my precious time with a person who was a racist and has black people in his employ. I could not at the time understand why the black guests never said anything. I took a couple of minutes next to my car just trying to come myself down before hitting the road. When on my way home, I got a call from one of the guests who told me that seconds after my departure everyone proceeded to leave the dinner and very little was said expect the explosion of not so pleasant words in an act of complete distaste at the hosts audacity.

Now get this….. the host is black!

This got me so conflicted…. I could not fathom how a person can consider their own race baboons. I thought back at the blog I wrote about language on TV for some insight at this since most of the people providing comments were of different races. It did not help much but offered me an optional avenue to review.

When I got home my phone buzzed and it was a text msg from the host that read: “I don’t understand what was so bad. I believe white people consider black people baboons despite what you might think. They do. Thank you for ruining my dinner”

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I could not respond. I was completely taken aback since everything I could have text in anger would prove him right in a way. So kept to myself! All I could think was erase, delete and forget. But I thought no, let me write a blog and find out if others feel this host was correct or not!

I even thought, maybe it’s those Nigger analogies black people give…. As in “black people can call each other Nigger, but white people are not allowed”. As Oprah pointed out on one of her shows, that they are both not allowed and when used it becomes an energy which feeds from such use (negative or positive). Or women saying “they can call each other “bitches” but men are not allowed”. As the case was on an episode of Girlfriends when “Joan” addressed the use of the word “bitch” after Maya discovered her son using it on his myspace video.

Does this mean black people can call each other baboons and the rest are not allowed?

Consider the result if a white person drew parallels between the behavior of black people and baboons. PRIME TIME NEWS SPECIAL ALERT!

Mr Enright, 40, a partner in London law firm Howe & Co, was appalled when he and his black wife and two young children found Tintin In The Congo a children's book in the shop in their home town of St Albans. In a letter of complaint he wrote: "Before passing the book to my wife and two boys (aged two-and-a-half and seven) I opened the book. I was utterly astonished and aghast to see page after page of representations of black African people as baboons or monkeys, bowing before a white teenager and speaking like retarded baboons."

The store agreed to remove the book from its children's section and stock it instead in its adult "graphics" section, but a CRE spokeswoman said that did not go far enough. Despite being published in 35 languages, Tintin In The Congo has only been available in English since 2005, and even then with a warning about the treatment of its subject material.

I am drawing this example because Steven Spielberg is producing The Adventures of Tintin" which is supposed to be the next Harry Potter. Production has been postponed for December.

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Could it be that multinationals and writers including the our very own media, have such views of race that they are engraved in peoples minds so much so that they believe to a point of such extreme versions of their reality. How sad it must be to go through your life thinking such horrible references to oneself.

I want to know what you think about how certain black people discriminate against their own kind. Even if it’s in jest. Also, what do you think of the use of the following words on television:

Bitch towards women - no racial preference!
Nigger towards black people by either white or fellow black actor/person!

I also would like to know the following:

Have you had a boss, colleague or friend who refers to you or others in any degrading word either same race or different race? If so can you share?

Have you experienced a racist comment or situation taking place in your full view? What did you do when it happened?

Please answer as best as you can.

By The Observer

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54 Comments

myname
24 Nov 2008 11:54

Oh no dear sorry nhe. And 2 ansa ur q's. Babes no one messes with Myname. We r black & white & so far no one degrade anybody. If there is, well they r good at pretending & i dare some1 calling me a baboon. My heel is my savior. Ndakumnqoqa! BTW i hope u neva vomit that good food though.....

cleve
24 Nov 2008 11:59

We as blacks do not appreciate ourselves and our culture. We think that speaking English with an accent makes you posh and all the western ways of doing things makes you better than the average black person. If we can't appreciate ourselves and where we come from how do we expect others to accept us.

I am one of those people who think doing things the "black" way is not so cool. I would maybe joke about it, but goes to show that people around me are listening and not taking such things as jokes. I LOVE BEING BLACk and I should learn to appreciate the way I am.

Thanks Observer for making me realise how ignorant I am. 


GML
24 Nov 2008 12:18

Well, I think the reason racism still exists is because we black people are racist to our own people. Calling other black people baboons is like giving white people permission to do the same. They wont see anything wrong with that seeing that we use such words.

Does he (host) wear suits and does he talk English? If he does then it's a shame really that he considers himself a baboon. I'm so annoyed right now.

WTF? Have we educated ourselves so much so that we can degrade each other at the end of the day??? If he sees nothing wrong with that then he should not converse in English as this makes him look like a Baboon.

My Director says the only thing black people are good for is shaking their a$$e$

myname
24 Nov 2008 11:54

Oh no dear sorry nhe. And 2 ansa ur q's. Babes no one messes with Myname. We r black & white & so far no one degrade anybody. If there is, well they r good at pretending & i dare some1 calling me a baboon. My heel is my savior. Ndakumnqoqa! BTW i hope u neva vomit that good food though.....

cleve
24 Nov 2008 11:59

We as blacks do not appreciate ourselves and our culture. We think that speaking English with an accent makes you posh and all the western ways of doing things makes you better than the average black person. If we can't appreciate ourselves and where we come from how do we expect others to accept us.

I am one of those people who think doing things the "black" way is not so cool. I would maybe joke about it, but goes to show that people around me are listening and not taking such things as jokes. I LOVE BEING BLACk and I should learn to appreciate the way I am.

Thanks Observer for making me realise how ignorant I am. 


carino
24 Nov 2008 12:36

When I got home my phone buzzed and it was a text msg from the host that read: “I don’t understand what was so bad. I believe white people consider black people baboons despite what you might think. They do. Thank you for ruining my dinner”

triple kwa'zzz..... Shem, things some black people do in order to fit in...

Someone once said *the terrible thing about Apartheid was not the segregation, it was the incarceration of the mind.*

PrettyPree
24 Nov 2008 12:36

I cannot believe this idiot...........How can he, mara????

sweetie my baby
24 Nov 2008 12:39

crazy - sounds like one of those sad and confused little blacks who thinks he can be in good books with white people by dissing his own - doesn't realise what a pathetic creature it makes him look to ALL races...

and he needs to understand he ruined his OWN dinner! sies! the nerve. did he think people walked out just in solidarity to you??? NOOO fool - it's coz your a$$ was inappropriate and you said some unacceptable ish! now DEAL WITH IT! NEWS FLASH - black people don't like being insulted with racist drivel, and people from other races don't like to be there to witness it -

another thing - black on black violence is just a sad thing, and played out.... just stop it! stop it!!

don't bother to sms back, just direct him to this blog and ask him to read it and everyone's responses.

it is NOT OKAY to self-hate, you don't come off as being clever, cutting edge or 'truth telling' - you just expose your own insecurities, and allow people to walk all over you coz you're so obviously self hating.

GML
24 Nov 2008 12:18

Well, I think the reason racism still exists is because we black people are racist to our own people. Calling other black people baboons is like giving white people permission to do the same. They wont see anything wrong with that seeing that we use such words.

Does he (host) wear suits and does he talk English? If he does then it's a shame really that he considers himself a baboon. I'm so annoyed right now.

WTF? Have we educated ourselves so much so that we can degrade each other at the end of the day??? If he sees nothing wrong with that then he should not converse in English as this makes him look like a Baboon.

My Director says the only thing black people are good for is shaking their a$$e$

Ms. Jay
24 Nov 2008 12:44

Its so sad that we still have race demarcations - the way I see things, the color of your skin has little to do with who you are or become in life, unfortunately we choose to play the race card and our race then determines who we become- *sigh*sigh*

the host needs to check himself - how low can you go? liking yourself to a baboon? come on - he was not saying that in jest.......he wanted to fit in with the "lighter black people"

Well - he said those words...and if he is believing that stupid statement he uttered - guess what - he will end up with the mannerisms of a baboon......no jokes - you become what you think

uselessness.....

Ms. Jay
24 Nov 2008 12:47

and to say that you ruined his party was THE joke of the evening - so pathetic - passing the buck down the tree.....shame direct him to TVSA - please!!!!! he needs some TVSA counselling.............kwakwakwa

witty lady
24 Nov 2008 12:51

I just love ama-articles written by the observer! k, let me go read.

carino
24 Nov 2008 12:53

When I got home my phone buzzed and it was a text msg from the host that read: “I don’t understand what was so bad. I believe white people consider black people baboons despite what you might think. They do. Thank you for ruining my dinner”

I'm still LMAO at this statement.... how sad....

carino
24 Nov 2008 12:36

When I got home my phone buzzed and it was a text msg from the host that read: “I don’t understand what was so bad. I believe white people consider black people baboons despite what you might think. They do. Thank you for ruining my dinner”

triple kwa'zzz..... Shem, things some black people do in order to fit in...

Someone once said *the terrible thing about Apartheid was not the segregation, it was the incarceration of the mind.*

PrettyPree
24 Nov 2008 12:36

I cannot believe this idiot...........How can he, mara????

sweetie my baby
24 Nov 2008 12:39

crazy - sounds like one of those sad and confused little blacks who thinks he can be in good books with white people by dissing his own - doesn't realise what a pathetic creature it makes him look to ALL races...

and he needs to understand he ruined his OWN dinner! sies! the nerve. did he think people walked out just in solidarity to you??? NOOO fool - it's coz your a$$ was inappropriate and you said some unacceptable ish! now DEAL WITH IT! NEWS FLASH - black people don't like being insulted with racist drivel, and people from other races don't like to be there to witness it -

another thing - black on black violence is just a sad thing, and played out.... just stop it! stop it!!

don't bother to sms back, just direct him to this blog and ask him to read it and everyone's responses.

it is NOT OKAY to self-hate, you don't come off as being clever, cutting edge or 'truth telling' - you just expose your own insecurities, and allow people to walk all over you coz you're so obviously self hating.

witty lady
24 Nov 2008 13:08

Oh my gosh!! I cant believe its a black person that said that!! what a shocker... what does he think he's white and that white people are superior?
we'll never hear the end of comments like this mara coming from our own poeple....

What a let down bathong.

Ms. Jay
24 Nov 2008 12:44

Its so sad that we still have race demarcations - the way I see things, the color of your skin has little to do with who you are or become in life, unfortunately we choose to play the race card and our race then determines who we become- *sigh*sigh*

the host needs to check himself - how low can you go? liking yourself to a baboon? come on - he was not saying that in jest.......he wanted to fit in with the "lighter black people"

Well - he said those words...and if he is believing that stupid statement he uttered - guess what - he will end up with the mannerisms of a baboon......no jokes - you become what you think

uselessness.....

Ms. Jay
24 Nov 2008 12:47

and to say that you ruined his party was THE joke of the evening - so pathetic - passing the buck down the tree.....shame direct him to TVSA - please!!!!! he needs some TVSA counselling.............kwakwakwa

witty lady
24 Nov 2008 12:51

I just love ama-articles written by the observer! k, let me go read.

carino
24 Nov 2008 12:53

When I got home my phone buzzed and it was a text msg from the host that read: “I don’t understand what was so bad. I believe white people consider black people baboons despite what you might think. They do. Thank you for ruining my dinner”

I'm still LMAO at this statement.... how sad....

Sbam
24 Nov 2008 13:32

This is sad "black people hating ourselves", otherwise  what other explanation is there!!!  Look how we treat(ed) our own brothers/sistas from other african countries, just because their darker-skinned than us, and on the ada hand practically bowing down & kissing the behind of a lighter-coloured species. hence kere re utlwisa bohloko.

We need to come to a realisation that we r black & were created to be, there is/was no mistake about that, we therefore need to accept, love and appreciate ourselves as who we are.  It is then other races will start to do the same 2 us

Have you experienced a racist comment or situation taking place in your full view? What did you do when it happened? 
I was nu here @ work and by sheer mistake i walked into this racist episode where a white influencial member(being a NB-client)  @ work was harassing one gel. calling her "k" word and all.  She didn't stand-up for herself & i also  didn't say anything, i'd wanted to but chickened out & my excuse @ the time was "i'm didn't wanna compromise my position mosebetsing of motjha" which is no xcuse @ all. but now looking back, now that i'm older and wiser i realised that,  i should have stood-up 4 her & da rest of us(maNdaki).  But it was the first & da last tym letting something like that go-on unchallenged, that's 4sure!!!

witty lady
24 Nov 2008 13:08

Oh my gosh!! I cant believe its a black person that said that!! what a shocker... what does he think he's white and that white people are superior?
we'll never hear the end of comments like this mara coming from our own poeple....

What a let down bathong.

Sbam
24 Nov 2008 13:32

This is sad "black people hating ourselves", otherwise  what other explanation is there!!!  Look how we treat(ed) our own brothers/sistas from other african countries, just because their darker-skinned than us, and on the ada hand practically bowing down & kissing the behind of a lighter-coloured species. hence kere re utlwisa bohloko.

We need to come to a realisation that we r black & were created to be, there is/was no mistake about that, we therefore need to accept, love and appreciate ourselves as who we are.  It is then other races will start to do the same 2 us

Have you experienced a racist comment or situation taking place in your full view? What did you do when it happened? 
I was nu here @ work and by sheer mistake i walked into this racist episode where a white influencial member(being a NB-client)  @ work was harassing one gel. calling her "k" word and all.  She didn't stand-up for herself & i also  didn't say anything, i'd wanted to but chickened out & my excuse @ the time was "i'm didn't wanna compromise my position mosebetsing of motjha" which is no xcuse @ all. but now looking back, now that i'm older and wiser i realised that,  i should have stood-up 4 her & da rest of us(maNdaki).  But it was the first & da last tym letting something like that go-on unchallenged, that's 4sure!!!

azHOT
24 Nov 2008 14:32

all i can do is laugh. this sad soul(ur host) should be shot. put out of hs misery

azHOT
24 Nov 2008 14:34

im having serious wireless problems!!!!

Msoe
24 Nov 2008 14:43

Well, I did look at that Oprah show and I still can remember the statement Joan made when Jubari made that video. I guess that Americans dont really have an issue when they call each other names such as 'bitches', 'niggas' and stuff. Also i dont think i will mind when a person I KNOW calls me a kaffir or those racist words. But i think that the hosts thinking is wrong, even if it means he was just making a joke. The place, time and the events itself was just not right. To prove d that he was not joking by sending that SMS. But then what he said was not in the right context, even if a close friend or best boozom has said that to me i would have been offended because automatically he is degrading me, himself and the whole other black people out there.

Blackcherry
24 Nov 2008 14:43

I'm feeling you Observer on this one.  I'm in CPT & I can relate to what you are saying. The sad thing is that you are more likely to get good service in a restuarant from a white waiter/waitress than from a black one. Unless offcourse they are foreigners. Our black South African sisters and brothers treat us like we do not belong in these fancy places. Somehow we have no right to be there. They treat abantu abamhlophe like the baas from back in the day. And the really sad thing is, I sometimes think they cant help themselves. They dont know better. Thats how they were raised.

azHOT
24 Nov 2008 14:32

all i can do is laugh. this sad soul(ur host) should be shot. put out of hs misery

azHOT
24 Nov 2008 14:34

im having serious wireless problems!!!!

Luke
24 Nov 2008 15:13

Crazy stuff, Observer. I can relate entirely to black-on-black racism - here is an extract from an article I wrote (on another website) about a real-life experience of mine in which a black policeman showed up his own racism:

------------------------------Extract Begins--------------------------------

We'd just finished studying invisible theatre and we were given acting assignments in class. Three of my mates were doing a scene from some play and they decided to go and rehearse their scene together outside in the Company Gardens.

The Gardens are a huge park in the middle of the city of Cape Town, with a path that runs right through it for about a kilometre. Many people use the park to take a shortcut from the top of town to the bottom, while others take their lunch hour there and eat their sandwiches under the trees, on the grass.

There are benches dotted all over the Gardens and the three actors went out to use one of them to rehearse on.

The scene involved two white guys (racists, obviously) who come upon a coloured guy lying on a bench (a bergie, or vagrant). My mate Ozzie was the coloured guy and when Ozzie pretends to be a bergie you just gotta believe it, man - the guy is class.

So Ozzie got dressed up in a filthy sack for a coat, swilled his mouth with garlic and cheap wine to make his breath stink, filthied himself up and wet the front of his pants to make it look like he'd pissed himself, and organised a half-jack of some cheap, vile substance.

The real deal, man.

He lay down on the bench and pretended to be sleeping and 10 minutes later the two white guys came up (I think their characters were ex-military types, or something) and started yelling at him.

They were using the rehearsed lines from the play, of course, and being mad-for-it students and oh-so-crazy they gave it the whole hog.

Naturally a crowd gathered - this was 1991 and Madiba had only been freed one year previously, so any sort of racial tension was a guaranteed headliner. But the actors kept going - until a black policeman arrived.

Not an actor, this oke - he was the real deal. Must have been one of the first ever black policemen in South Africa, now that I think of it - an armed one, at any rate.

This guy came poncing in there and didn't even bother to ask questions or check out the scene - he spotted two white guys yelling Afrikaans insults at a bergie and he dived in headfirst.

Grabbing Ozzie by the scruff of the neck he started lambasting him from a dizzy height about how filthy drunks like him mess up the city, and he even hauled out his truncheon, ready to deliver a few telling blows.

Since these guys were just students - and not genuine invisible theatre actors - they stepped in at that point and revealed who they were, and after some huffing and puffing the whole thing dissipated and they came back to class.

But since up until that point it was invisible theatre that policeman was an honest audience member, and the social message was clear as daylight.

---------------------------------------Extract Ends---------------------------------------

It was clear to me through this story that black people were trying to come to terms with a society that had suddenly - in the space of a couple of years - changed dramatically.

That cop should have arrested the white guys for beating up a bergie - instead he took their side, for reasons known only to himself.

However - that was 17 years ago. It's shocking to me that such attitudes still exist today - I guess we've still got a very long way to go to achieve balance.

I think Blackcherry got it right in her post above:

They treat abantu abamhlop

Msoe
24 Nov 2008 14:43

Well, I did look at that Oprah show and I still can remember the statement Joan made when Jubari made that video. I guess that Americans dont really have an issue when they call each other names such as 'bitches', 'niggas' and stuff. Also i dont think i will mind when a person I KNOW calls me a kaffir or those racist words. But i think that the hosts thinking is wrong, even if it means he was just making a joke. The place, time and the events itself was just not right. To prove d that he was not joking by sending that SMS. But then what he said was not in the right context, even if a close friend or best boozom has said that to me i would have been offended because automatically he is degrading me, himself and the whole other black people out there.

Blackcherry
24 Nov 2008 14:43

I'm feeling you Observer on this one.  I'm in CPT & I can relate to what you are saying. The sad thing is that you are more likely to get good service in a restuarant from a white waiter/waitress than from a black one. Unless offcourse they are foreigners. Our black South African sisters and brothers treat us like we do not belong in these fancy places. Somehow we have no right to be there. They treat abantu abamhlophe like the baas from back in the day. And the really sad thing is, I sometimes think they cant help themselves. They dont know better. Thats how they were raised.

Luke
24 Nov 2008 15:13

Crazy stuff, Observer. I can relate entirely to black-on-black racism - here is an extract from an article I wrote (on another website) about a real-life experience of mine in which a black policeman showed up his own racism:

------------------------------Extract Begins--------------------------------

We'd just finished studying invisible theatre and we were given acting assignments in class. Three of my mates were doing a scene from some play and they decided to go and rehearse their scene together outside in the Company Gardens.

The Gardens are a huge park in the middle of the city of Cape Town, with a path that runs right through it for about a kilometre. Many people use the park to take a shortcut from the top of town to the bottom, while others take their lunch hour there and eat their sandwiches under the trees, on the grass.

There are benches dotted all over the Gardens and the three actors went out to use one of them to rehearse on.

The scene involved two white guys (racists, obviously) who come upon a coloured guy lying on a bench (a bergie, or vagrant). My mate Ozzie was the coloured guy and when Ozzie pretends to be a bergie you just gotta believe it, man - the guy is class.

So Ozzie got dressed up in a filthy sack for a coat, swilled his mouth with garlic and cheap wine to make his breath stink, filthied himself up and wet the front of his pants to make it look like he'd pissed himself, and organised a half-jack of some cheap, vile substance.

The real deal, man.

He lay down on the bench and pretended to be sleeping and 10 minutes later the two white guys came up (I think their characters were ex-military types, or something) and started yelling at him.

They were using the rehearsed lines from the play, of course, and being mad-for-it students and oh-so-crazy they gave it the whole hog.

Naturally a crowd gathered - this was 1991 and Madiba had only been freed one year previously, so any sort of racial tension was a guaranteed headliner. But the actors kept going - until a black policeman arrived.

Not an actor, this oke - he was the real deal. Must have been one of the first ever black policemen in South Africa, now that I think of it - an armed one, at any rate.

This guy came poncing in there and didn't even bother to ask questions or check out the scene - he spotted two white guys yelling Afrikaans insults at a bergie and he dived in headfirst.

Grabbing Ozzie by the scruff of the neck he started lambasting him from a dizzy height about how filthy drunks like him mess up the city, and he even hauled out his truncheon, ready to deliver a few telling blows.

Since these guys were just students - and not genuine invisible theatre actors - they stepped in at that point and revealed who they were, and after some huffing and puffing the whole thing dissipated and they came back to class.

But since up until that point it was invisible theatre that policeman was an honest audience member, and the social message was clear as daylight.

---------------------------------------Extract Ends---------------------------------------

It was clear to me through this story that black people were trying to come to terms with a society that had suddenly - in the space of a couple of years - changed dramatically.

That cop should have arrested the white guys for beating up a bergie - instead he took their side, for reasons known only to himself.

However - that was 17 years ago. It's shocking to me that such attitudes still exist today - I guess we've still got a very long way to go to achieve balance.

I think Blackcherry got it right in her post above:

They treat abantu abamhlop

myname
24 Nov 2008 15:39

Guys this racism will neva end even if ANC can rule till whatever. Even abo sistas from shops, im talking about cashiers mna. They can greet a white person with a huge colget smile but when its black, You r damn lucky if u get that hello or else u get that hello uza nzima without a smile as if u borrowed the money from her (I guess u know why i say "her" coz i always get that attitude from females).....

myname
24 Nov 2008 15:39

Guys this racism will neva end even if ANC can rule till whatever. Even abo sistas from shops, im talking about cashiers mna. They can greet a white person with a huge colget smile but when its black, You r damn lucky if u get that hello or else u get that hello uza nzima without a smile as if u borrowed the money from her (I guess u know why i say "her" coz i always get that attitude from females).....

TheObserver
24 Nov 2008 16:18

Luke  all I could say is WOW! Those guys must try and do the same in JHB for experimental purposes. It should be interesting to know what would happend  17 years later. It would also be interesting to bring in a 17year old for some comments just to see how they re-act as opposed to the adults.

Myname I don't think its an ANC issue or political issue. Even if they do contribute in one way or the other. But I think its a matter of basic deceny and humanity on the part of those infected by such vile veiws of thier own race.

azHOT the idea is too tempting but does not change the mentality.

To all those wrote comments, thanks.. ... your comments are realy helping me understand this whole mess.

superwoman
24 Nov 2008 16:19

Great article indeed.....
The word nigger was invented and used by the white man to belittle and crush the black mans self worth.the aim was to vandilise our self esteem so that we could feel inferior in our colour.it's shameful to find that we as black people still refer to each other as niggers.that word was used to degrade us,so even if we don't hear it much from white people these days,we are still carrying the weight of that word with us if we  are not ashamed to just use it.it was a word used to degrade us,come on guys,our future generations to come need to know that it is not at all HIP to use that word, but it all depends on us.

cnhlanhla
24 Nov 2008 16:28

I don't mean to be off line from the questions you asked OBSERVER.....

where I work there is this other mantainance guy who is white..now what always puzzles me with him is that its not really that he does racial type of acts or something. but nje mostly when ever he's using a phone calling wherever, and then maybe get asked his name. you will hear him say my name is Nando "but I'm not black".

And I'd be wondering, is being  black so carsed na bakithi?...I mean does he really have to specify,just because his name sounds "blackish" (that what he normally say by the way).

cnhlanhla
24 Nov 2008 16:31

but now that you've mentioned what we blacks are calling each other....then it kinda make sence that usuke engafuni to give the person on the other side of the phone a "baboonish'' image of him.

TheObserver
24 Nov 2008 16:18

Luke  all I could say is WOW! Those guys must try and do the same in JHB for experimental purposes. It should be interesting to know what would happend  17 years later. It would also be interesting to bring in a 17year old for some comments just to see how they re-act as opposed to the adults.

Myname I don't think its an ANC issue or political issue. Even if they do contribute in one way or the other. But I think its a matter of basic deceny and humanity on the part of those infected by such vile veiws of thier own race.

azHOT the idea is too tempting but does not change the mentality.

To all those wrote comments, thanks.. ... your comments are realy helping me understand this whole mess.

andi01
24 Nov 2008 16:42

My view on the word Nigga (as most of you how fond of it I am). There is a belief or a norm that I heard from my grandfather. He used to say, one thing that made him strong in the apartheid days, was that. White people will use hateful words, phrases, names and statements towards black people, and in a weird way, black people always try to creator some humour out of the situation, just to laugh and ease the pain and pass the time.

He says the name nigga is from niggro, but blacks chose to pronounce it wrongly, to provoke sarcasm hence they were thought as stupid people.

But if anyone can call me a kaffir or a baboon, so help me Gawd

superwoman
24 Nov 2008 16:19

Great article indeed.....
The word nigger was invented and used by the white man to belittle and crush the black mans self worth.the aim was to vandilise our self esteem so that we could feel inferior in our colour.it's shameful to find that we as black people still refer to each other as niggers.that word was used to degrade us,so even if we don't hear it much from white people these days,we are still carrying the weight of that word with us if we  are not ashamed to just use it.it was a word used to degrade us,come on guys,our future generations to come need to know that it is not at all HIP to use that word, but it all depends on us.

andi01
24 Nov 2008 16:44

Also the administrator, where I work, she is soo racist and the harder she tries to hide it, the clearer it bcomz. She gets so pissed off if she answers the phone, and the person on the other side asks “hi is that Andi”. She bcoms grumpy the whole week. And clients do that often

cnhlanhla
24 Nov 2008 16:28

I don't mean to be off line from the questions you asked OBSERVER.....

where I work there is this other mantainance guy who is white..now what always puzzles me with him is that its not really that he does racial type of acts or something. but nje mostly when ever he's using a phone calling wherever, and then maybe get asked his name. you will hear him say my name is Nando "but I'm not black".

And I'd be wondering, is being  black so carsed na bakithi?...I mean does he really have to specify,just because his name sounds "blackish" (that what he normally say by the way).

cnhlanhla
24 Nov 2008 16:31

but now that you've mentioned what we blacks are calling each other....then it kinda make sence that usuke engafuni to give the person on the other side of the phone a "baboonish'' image of him.

andi01
24 Nov 2008 16:42

My view on the word Nigga (as most of you how fond of it I am). There is a belief or a norm that I heard from my grandfather. He used to say, one thing that made him strong in the apartheid days, was that. White people will use hateful words, phrases, names and statements towards black people, and in a weird way, black people always try to creator some humour out of the situation, just to laugh and ease the pain and pass the time.

He says the name nigga is from niggro, but blacks chose to pronounce it wrongly, to provoke sarcasm hence they were thought as stupid people.

But if anyone can call me a kaffir or a baboon, so help me Gawd

andi01
24 Nov 2008 16:44

Also the administrator, where I work, she is soo racist and the harder she tries to hide it, the clearer it bcomz. She gets so pissed off if she answers the phone, and the person on the other side asks “hi is that Andi”. She bcoms grumpy the whole week. And clients do that often

mahlangubn
25 Nov 2008 14:41

My take on this is that even if one is caucasion, asian, black, oriental etc we are still different, that's the beauty of creation, we cannot think the same, we cannot act the same, we cannot reason the same, that's being an individual.  I embrace my individuality, I can relate to anykind of mankind I choose to.  There are people in my young observation who do not possess any opinion of themselves, they live by the standards of whatever external influences that might catch their attention at that moment, so a person who believes that they are boboons probably is a baboon themselves, so, becasue they don't have any "back bone" they would tend to generalise and say everyone is a baboon.  A baboon has its own purpose in life, and will live according to that purpose without letting any foreign influence change its baboonness.  That's what I admire about animals, you cannot change it. So a human being, unfortunately has a WILL to choose to be anything they want to be, I work in a tertiary institution and believe me I have met a lot of people who choose to be the stupidest of the entire species yet appearing to be all polished and elite, Have you ever met a beautiful, expensive, loaded stupid person, they rarely search within to introspect and deduce their environment, like a person who will throw a lit stump of cigarette in the veld and cause damage unnecessarily.  So your host - probably wanted to experiment somehow, cos I cannot understand why "IT" said whateva "IT" said. 

Ntombi nto
25 Nov 2008 15:07

The racism is in so many aspects hey. 
I was recently in South Africa, I have lived in the London for a few years now. And I am always excited to go home where I expect everything black to be mainstream. 
At least until I went to a Pick and Pay wanting to buy spray for my braids. First I had to go through an entire aisle of shelves of all sorts of caucasian hair shampoos, conditioners and hair colour. And then I finally located the single shelf with a few "representative black" hair products.
I found it very insulting that the entire aile catered to a minority in the country while the clear majority had to find themselces a charlie parkers of diskom to complete their shopping. 
I am not even sure if a white girl can find everything she wants at pick and pay but there sure is enough. Are we really still at the age where marketers aim to sell to the white family knowing that the black person will simply but because the white family is buying there???

mahlangubn
25 Nov 2008 14:41

My take on this is that even if one is caucasion, asian, black, oriental etc we are still different, that's the beauty of creation, we cannot think the same, we cannot act the same, we cannot reason the same, that's being an individual.  I embrace my individuality, I can relate to anykind of mankind I choose to.  There are people in my young observation who do not possess any opinion of themselves, they live by the standards of whatever external influences that might catch their attention at that moment, so a person who believes that they are boboons probably is a baboon themselves, so, becasue they don't have any "back bone" they would tend to generalise and say everyone is a baboon.  A baboon has its own purpose in life, and will live according to that purpose without letting any foreign influence change its baboonness.  That's what I admire about animals, you cannot change it. So a human being, unfortunately has a WILL to choose to be anything they want to be, I work in a tertiary institution and believe me I have met a lot of people who choose to be the stupidest of the entire species yet appearing to be all polished and elite, Have you ever met a beautiful, expensive, loaded stupid person, they rarely search within to introspect and deduce their environment, like a person who will throw a lit stump of cigarette in the veld and cause damage unnecessarily.  So your host - probably wanted to experiment somehow, cos I cannot understand why "IT" said whateva "IT" said. 

Ntombi nto
25 Nov 2008 15:07

The racism is in so many aspects hey. 
I was recently in South Africa, I have lived in the London for a few years now. And I am always excited to go home where I expect everything black to be mainstream. 
At least until I went to a Pick and Pay wanting to buy spray for my braids. First I had to go through an entire aisle of shelves of all sorts of caucasian hair shampoos, conditioners and hair colour. And then I finally located the single shelf with a few "representative black" hair products.
I found it very insulting that the entire aile catered to a minority in the country while the clear majority had to find themselces a charlie parkers of diskom to complete their shopping. 
I am not even sure if a white girl can find everything she wants at pick and pay but there sure is enough. Are we really still at the age where marketers aim to sell to the white family knowing that the black person will simply but because the white family is buying there???

Bongok
26 Nov 2008 12:24

Talking of such an interesting article and following up on Ntombi nto's reply, have you noticed how we really strive to look everything white, I particularly do not like the way Ntombi (Sonia Sedibe) in Generubbish has had her hair styled lately. May be it is because I just like the afro look tough as it is to manage. It is such things that make us to downgrade all that is natural to us and we strive to be like the good old baas.And as "The Secret" puts it clearly -  you attract what you send off.

Bongok
26 Nov 2008 12:24

Talking of such an interesting article and following up on Ntombi nto's reply, have you noticed how we really strive to look everything white, I particularly do not like the way Ntombi (Sonia Sedibe) in Generubbish has had her hair styled lately. May be it is because I just like the afro look tough as it is to manage. It is such things that make us to downgrade all that is natural to us and we strive to be like the good old baas.And as "The Secret" puts it clearly -  you attract what you send off.


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